Xavier Thoughts: Is It or Isn't It?

Sunday, August 13, 2006

Is It or Isn't It?

Here is a possible self defense encounter caught on tape. It's veracity is in question, but it is none the less fascinating. What do you think? Language may not be suitable for work.

16 Comments:

The Wolfman said...: I say staged...

but if it isn't, the dips**ts had it coming to them, following and making threats and generally being the a**hole "tough" guys...; 11:39 AM
Ride Fast said...: Hi Xavier,
FYI - about half the time video's on your blog won't run for me.

I usually include a link in the title if it's an outside source like Goggle.

As you know, I'm on blogspot also, but I have no idea why the vid's won't run sometimes.

Thanks and take care,
Fodder; 12:15 PM
Fletch said...: Totally justified.

The scary thing is that this could happen to anyone at any time. He probably didn't even know that he'd cut them off.

People don't realize how easily they could find themselves in a situation like this, and the police won't always be able to be on scene fast enough. I've heard of situations like this where the person following started ramming the car.

As to whether or not it was staged; I don't think it was only because it had so many cuts. Usually staged stuff like this takes about 3 minutes to go from "hey, he cut me off" to smashing the car with a bat.

PS: don't threated guys who look like cops, that was the first thing I noticed when I saw him.; 12:23 PM
Porta's Cat said...: staged or not, it is realistic in the situation one would be likely to be dealing with.

This kind of thing is more likley to happen than fighting off the Red Horde or being the next Mad Max.; 12:54 PM
Anonymous said...: Hmm.
Seems staged; a bit too pat.

In any case, there are several violations of good self-defense thinking here.

Escalation (the infamous finger), and not only not driving to a safe location, but heading down a dead-end dirt road (!?). Probably so actual law enforcement would not inadvertantly - and possibly fatally - interfere with the last act of their little drama.

Nope, sorry, don't buy it.

And a bad example of proper armed citizen mindset.; 1:16 PM
Anonymous said...: I call shenanigans.

Looked totally staged, especially considering the length of build-up time from initial contact to climax.

The revolver looked a little airsofty/watergun like to me, and his gun handling was straight out of the HBO school of shooting.

Anyway, IMO, while drawing on the guy was totally justified, Mr BMW gave up several good opportunities to disengage and stupidly put himself in a position that he might have to shoot a guy. Not smart.

And sending his girl to retrieve the camera? Also highly Not Smart. But funny. :); 1:19 PM
Anonymous said...: watched it once..seemed real to me.

there are some elements of fear and a weird politeness that come right before and after the gun drawing (on the part of the BMW guy) that make seem like the real thing.

I would have had the guy drop the bat and sit on the ground. I also would have taken the tape rather than steal the camera. The whole theft of the camera as restitution is another thing that makes it seem realistic though...especially after suffering all those verbal insults.

I thought about it...I just think it is real. the one guy acted like one would when outnumbered and in disbelief about the situation.; 2:44 PM
Hobie said...: It WAS interesting to watch.; 3:13 PM
Anonymous said...: well, seems like bubba #1 (the big one) was going to do some body work on the BMW because everybody knows you get to go off like Charles Bronson anytime somebody you don't like cuts you off.

I also wouldn't want my camera back with all the incriminating evidence recorded on it. That would be like calling the cops to say that somebody stole your bag of marijuana.; 4:19 PM
Fletch said...: Actually, he may not have been carrying that gun legally. In which case he might not want to involve the police, and would want the confrontation in a quiet place (and he would probably want the evidence of the confrontation).

Just a thought...; 5:02 PM
Anonymous said...: I say not real.

It does remind me of the occasion a few years ago when I was driving home from an IDPA match with two of my shooting buddies. We were tired but content with our performance in the match. The car was loaded to the gills with guns and ammo. I was doing exactly the speed limit through a town known for its speed traps, when a car full of black people started tailgating me. Talk about not having any idea who you're messing with....; 7:29 PM
Anonymous said...: Definitely staged.
Looks like Canadian anti-gun propaganda to me: the Toyota driving "rednecks" (check the logo on the steering wheel) used the word "eh" about 4,000 times.
(Do Americans talk like that? Do true "rednecks" drive expensive Toyota 4x4s or beat up domestic trucks?)
Mr. BMW has enough brains to obtain a BMW and a firearm--but not enough to conceptualize a way to avoid risking everything he's earned?
Sounds trite.
"How could this be anti-gun propaganda?" you ask.
Anti-gun propaganda doesn't just vilify gun bearers.
It typically portrays people in general as children incapable of controlling themselves once their "ego" gets bumped or bruised.
Mr. BMW definitely does all the wrong things.
When he saw he was dealing with idiots at the U-turn stage of the episode, he should have just said, "Sorry, I'm not from around here" and split a.s.a.p.
And as another viewer noted, the "redneck" who pulled the bat could have just as easily pulled a shotgun or rifle from the truck bed--Mr. BMW risked everything on the lonesome dirt road, trusting only his pea-shooter, like a complete idiot.
Had the "redneck" been for real, he would have probably NOT been driving a Toyota and probably WOULD HAVE HAD a shotgun and/or rifle as back up--not a ridiculous baseball bat.
Also, how many real "rednecks" collect their memoirs on a camcorder--or any other medium?
That is generally a pastime for geeks--esp. anti-gun geeks seeking to use "art," or rather, phoney "Documentary art," such as that of the Canadian nincompoop, Michael Moore, to make a profound "statement about society."
Nope.
I say it is not real.
I see it as anti-gun-culture propaganda aiming to portray the armed and the unarmed both as too stupid for their own good--and hence both parties as being in need of BIG BROTHER's protective banishment of firearms from the world, in the name of creating some sort of gun-free utopia planet.
I don't buy it for a second.
~ASMS; 2:09 AM
Anonymous said...: ... that was intense.. wow....

Eric; 11:40 AM
Anonymous said...: Poorly staged ... loks like hollywood bullshit.

If you are armed, you don't want to give a lawyer an excuse to paint you as the instigator.

In his situation, I would have said nothing ... I would have ignored them ... and if they had exited the truck and threatened me, I would have just pulled a pistol and started shooting them.

A pistol is not a wand of obedience ... it shoulnd't see daylight unless you need to immediatly start firing.; 1:12 PM
Anonymous said...: Kommander here...

Several things about this jump out at me. The first is that Mr. BMW is armed with some sort of revolver. From what I have seen most guys with that much money (and ego) will buy either a custom 1911 or a Sig/HK type pistol.

Now if I am in a car being chased around by some nuts I am gong to stay in populated, well traveled places so that in the event I do have to defend myself there will be plenty of witnesses. Driving down some random dirt road is way down on the list of smart things to do here.

Lastly in the even I ever did find myself trapped in a convertible vehicle about to be attacked by bat wielding nut I am going to shoot him. He is way too close to even consider anything else. After bat nut is down I would cover camera nut and instruct him to drop the camera (valuable evidence I wouldn't want him messing with) and to lie face down. If I had a cell phone and reception I call the cavalry, if I didn't while being chased. If I don't have a cell phone or signal I would collect the camera, take down descriptions and plate numbers and drive to the nearest police station.

I belive that this vid was either staged, or a poor example of a self defence situation, or perhaps both.; 9:35 PM
NotClauswitz said...: I just don't see how a fat canadian in red suspenders can be very frightning, even with a baseball bat - which he had a hard time finding in his fancy *burgundy* toyota pickup. Now maybe a skinny one with a lacrosse stick, driving a rustbucket - yeh. Except they aren't allowed to have hand-guns up there, eh? My wife thought it was a fake, or else he's in jail having posted it on the 'Net.; 1:27 PM